The White Devil of the Moon (Nanoha/SM)

[LiliandraNadiar]

Well, Sailor Moon R can be pretty much written off. S and at least Stars are pretty much independent of Crystal Tokyo so can still proceed 'a-peace'. Could upgrade the Senshi powers either through the long term fight against the Dark Kingdom or by old busy-body herself Pluto awakening more past life skills.

Speaking of... how would the Mistress and the Time Gates figure into the new line? CT was planned around Usagi, but this is Nanoha and she's also a good deal more experienced then Usagi ever wanted to be. If you subscribe to the fairly wide-spread convention that Puu is the universe's greatest voyeur and has been watching the inners, should she have also been aware of Nanoha and knows about her condition?

Would she try for the diplomatic approach between Fate and the inners, ally with Fate since using the Crystal and dieing would mess up any plans she might be working for, or see Fate/TSAB as a threat to 'her' princess?

[Arkeus]

Hotaru being "adopted" by a 13-14 years old Nanoha is a bit weird though (her accident was when she was 12).

Comar: well, we really have different views of fate. Jail didn't need to strike something true, just to strike something that bothers Fate.

And hwat is that thing? she is afraid to become like her mother, to become so attached to one thing that she can't see others, to decide that others should be sacrificed for her goals etc.

All those things still touch this Fate. She won't be able to "decide" that the senshi have no right to talk to nanoha, nor to "choose" for nanoha "for her own good".

Of course, that's what i believe :shrugs:

Hell, if Fate wasn't like that, and she *does* think Nanoha is her best friend/future lover, why is she constantly submissive in StrikerS?

I talked about using vita because as far as i know, Vita (and signum) are the only ones who really felt the incident, especially vita as she was there, and is quite a bit Tsundere for nanoha :shrugs:

[Heaven's Deamon]

Characters who are afraid of becoming like their parents, particularly Good guys whose parents are bad guys, is a relatively common thing.

Furthermore, for such a character they may never even think about comparing themself to their parent until someone else does, at which point they would review all their past actions to hopefully disprove the comparision, or angst if they find enough proof.

So Fate could easily have never though of comparing herself to Presia in such a way until Jail did, at which point it's somewhat natural for her to hesitate as she does the review.

[Arkeus]

Characters who are afraid of becoming like their parents, particularly Good guys whose parents are bad guys, is a relatively common thing.

Furthermore, for such a character they may never even think about comparing themself to their parent until someone else does, at which point they would review all their past actions to hopefully disprove the comparision, or angst if they find enough proof.

So Fate could easily have never though of comparing herself to Presia in such a way until Jail did, at which point it's somewhat natural for her to hesitate as she does the review.

Yes, all good points.

Of course, it *is* hinted that she did think about this quite a lot already, and that she will continue to do so.

[FOG3]

Are we talking about the same Generals who use telekinesis to throw Boeing 747s around like tinker toys (anime Jadeite) and put all of Tokyo under several feet of ice (manga Kunzite)?

Pretty sure those were 767s, possibly the 767-300s ordered by Japan Airlines. 747s have four engines the one's Jadeite had chasing the Senshi down had two. I don't think they were 737s or 757s as they just don't have the distinctive features of one to my recollection. The other two engine Boeing models have different engine configurations. There is also the posibility it could always have been a McDonnel-Douglas, Lockheed, or otherwise product. I'm pretty sure the intent was a 767-300, though.

767-300 would be about 86 Metric tons dry verse the 747's 162 to 185 metric ton dry weight depending on model.

Plus in the interest of full disclosure it should be pointed out he likely was just somehow manipulating the jet's controls. Either with his ability to create and control golems shown earlier when he took down security or otherwise. The more impressive thing was he survived getting nailed by one taking off with minimal injury. We're talking a jet between 86 and almost 159 metric tons tire slamming into this guy at take off speed which for a 767-300 is better then 100 knots.

Anything resembling a normal human should be in at least two pieces after something like that. We're talking something that weighs easily twice as much as the heavist modern tank rocketing by at better then a 100 knots slamming into a guy at a virtual stand still with the front tire here. You have to get pretty downright absurd to beat that.

For reference just in terms of pure energy a 150kg weight to overestimate the weight of things such as a Ranmaverse martial artist would have to be travelling at roughly Mach 3.7 to have the same kind of energy. They still wouldn't have the momentum. To get that our theoretical 150 kg Martial Artist would be travelling at better then twice escape velocity for Earth. Ergo he wouldn't be able even stay on the planet.

All that using min weight and speed figures for the 767. And people say anime Sailor Moon is weak.

[Not-Going-to-Tell]

For reference just in terms of pure energy a 150kg weight to overestimate the weight of things such as a Ranmaverse martial artist would have to be travelling at roughly Mach 3.7 to have the same kind of energy. They still wouldn't have the momentum. To get that our theoretical 150 kg Martial Artist would be travelling at better then twice escape velocity for Earth. Ergo he wouldn't be able even stay on the planet.

All that using min weight and speed figures for the 767. And people say anime Sailor Moon is weak.

Please excuse me for posting the following, which you reminded me of, but there is another example of Magic/power of friendship/courage screwing up calculations. Plus it's entertaining.

Once more, to be completist...Hell and Heaven!!!I'll switch from Iron to my old standby, Titanium, and specifically the titanium alloy they use for airplanes. I find an Ultimate Tensile Stress limit of 1000 megapascals. Now, I assume that the 2 hands joined as one can be appromixated as a cylinder of radius 5 meters, for a simulated surface area of about 78 meters square. Multipying Stress (force/area) by area gives a required force of 78 giganewtons.As above, Gaogaigar weighs 300,000kgs, so this is equivalent to an acceleration of some 260 kilometers per second squared. This kind of acceleration is frankly beyond insane and would see Gaogaigar go right through the zonder, dig a trench several hundred miles long and launch into space. So I'm going to assume I'm fucked up my sums somewhere, criminally overestimated how big Gaogaigar's hands are, or there's some sort of effect from the Broken and Protect hands that I can't calculate using conventional means.

On topic: What would the TSAB do about Setsuna? It just seems that the magitech beurocracy would not like someone that isn't loyal to them or otherwise controllable to have that much power.

[Zwzn]

This... is a very good, original idea. I like what I see, and wish to subscribe to your newsletter.

All joking aside, what happens after the Dark Kingdom falls? The other storylines follow? Because I CANNOT see Nanoha making Crystal Tokyo, then letting some upstarts jump through time. On the flipside, Vivio gets a new big sister or two, in all likelyhood, either from chibi-Nano or Hotaru.

The Messiah of Silence and the Daughter of the Saint team up. This idea will not leave my head now.

That is something people often forget when writing fanfics for Sailor Moon. There would be no Dark Moon Family if there was no Crystal Tokyo at least as seen. They would be very different people.

While there would be a Death Phantom, it's history would be different as well.

[bissek]

*Comar envisions Endymion and Fate glaring lightning bolts at each other while Nanoha looks on cluelessly*

And some point after Fate realizes that the Senshi want Nanoha to become a Senshi, she'll probably envision what Nanoha would look like in a fukufied barrier jacket (Especially the classier version of the jacket from the upcoming movie - see below) and either blush or nosebleed.



As for the Crystal Tokyo comments, I only really expect this story to go one SM season (After all, Nanoha's life after leaving junior high centers around her TSAB work on Midchilda, not her family in Japan, which takes her far away from the Senshi). If any prospective author can find a way to extend it to later seasons, though, I won't complain.

[Comartemis]

For reference just in terms of pure energy a 150kg weight to overestimate the weight of things such as a Ranmaverse martial artist would have to be travelling at roughly Mach 3.7 to have the same kind of energy. They still wouldn't have the momentum. To get that our theoretical 150 kg Martial Artist would be travelling at better then twice escape velocity for Earth. Ergo he wouldn't be able even stay on the planet.

...Fog, you wouldn't happen to know a guy named arkhangelsk by any chance, would you?

On topic: What would the TSAB do about Setsuna? It just seems that the magitech beurocracy would not like someone that isn't loyal to them or otherwise controllable to have that much power.

The Gates would probably be classified as a high-level but stable Lost Logia in need of immediate destruction/sealing to prevent the possibility of people traveling back into the timestreams of other universes and screwing things up with paradoxes and stuff. Setsuna may well be out of a job by the time the first season rolls around, assuming the bureau knows about the Gates at all.

While there would be a Death Phantom, it's history would be different as well.

DP would have a history for all of five minutes before he gets Befriended by Nanoha and/or Vivi--

....hold on a second. What if Crystal Tokyo becomes the new seat of the reformed Belkan Empire with Vivio (a few years down the line) in charge of things?

As for the Crystal Tokyo comments, I only really expect this story to go one SM season (After all, Nanoha's life after leaving junior high centers around her TSAB work on Midchilda, not her family in Japan, which takes her far away from the Senshi). If any prospective author can find a way to extend it to later seasons, though, I won't complain.

I don't think it would be too hard, it would just require some alterations to the StrikerS timeline. If Earth keeps being threatened by Chaos Spawn, then Nanoha will just keep coming back to put the smackdown on anything that looks at Earth the wrong way. First, though, we need to get through the first season before we can set up a definite sequence of events for later seasons.

[nuriko]

On topic: What would the TSAB do about Setsuna? It just seems that the magitech beurocracy would not like someone that isn't loyal to them or otherwise controllable to have that much power.

If Nanoha is Serenity, then Setsuna has an authority she recognizes which IS under TSAB orders, at least ... they might not be happy with the indirect control, but it's something.

[Arkeus]

mmmh, managed to see the ep with Jadeite controlling the plane.


Well, as far as i can see, it's just some kind of machine remote control power.

As for resisting the plane "impact", it's hard to quantify.

After all, the senshi were able to *outrun* it for quite some time, and we don't see the actual impact, just jadeite making a face. He may very well have teleported on impact, before he could be trampled (i very much doubt it was going faster than 30kph).

Doesn't mean much to me.

[Climhazard]

We're talking a jet between 86 and almost 159 metric tons tire slamming into this guy

You wrong on this one. Plane front wheel support only about a 10 percents of its entire weight. So, it not "almost 159 metric tons" but something like a 15.9. Still impressive, of course.

into this guy at take off speed which for a 767-300 is better then 100 knots

In this episode planes not even close to take off speed.

[FOG3]

*Checks on youtube* Definitely wrong about the nature of the impact, but it was a honest mistake.

I thought he was standing at the end of the landing strip exiting over the water, and he was getting chased by one that was just lifting off that made initial contact a little above the waist. Which would be akin to what happens when a little car plows under a tractor trailer, and has the entire top and half the driver sheered off, just worse.

Personally I just found the concept entertaing in its sheer absurdity. Especially with the tendency for excessive bashing on the Senshi's capabilities, and the ridiculous feats in manga.

...Fog, you wouldn't happen to know a guy named arkhangelsk by any chance, would you?

Can't say I have. Who is that if I may ask?

[Comartemis]

Can't say I have. Who is that if I may ask?

Just a really annoying guy who hangs out on the Animesuki Nanoha boards. He insists on measuring everything in animation in terms of real world physics and framerates and stuff like that, even if the solutions he gets run completely against what canon tells us.

He has an especially large beef with the idea that barrier jackets are effective methods of defense based on a single scene in StrikerS where Rein's jacket gets cut up a bit when she narrowly misses a head-on collision with one of Lutecia's bug summons, despite all the scenes we have of mages getting hit hard enough to put craters in concrete and surviving. There's one scene in particular where Erio gets blown into a concrete pillar and arkhangelsk tries to argue that the resulting crater stems from the fact that Mid-Childa uses crappy concrete, not because Erio was moving with a particularly huge amount of force.

Ark is known for stuff like that to the point where the Outer Cadians (the regulars on the Original Characters thread) coined the term "SoDomizing"--SoD as in Suspension of Disbelief--just to describe what he does to the series. Your post reminded me of him a bit.

[FOG3]

Oh. Excuse me, I have a sudden interest in cutting down someone who fails to comprehend the fundamental postulate of science.