Head Canon

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Re: Head Canon

Postby AxelTheBunny » Wed Jun 28, 2017 7:39 pm

TThe bamboo leaves really dont prove anything, as we are not aware of their effectiveness. It could work, or not.

The main issue with Ranma is that its a series where nothing REALLY changes. It's what is termed a Status Quo is god series.


Hell I've never seen Ranma and Akane's relationship as working out, mostly because their relationship has always felt a bit forced. It's not even a factor of "Akane would probably kill him between her temper and his mouth." That alot of people seem to believe. The two of them just dont seem to be compatible, and their personalities really dont mesh. This is ignoring the fact Akane does on occasion become physically abusive, since that falls more into the series slapstick tone. Even the argument that they almost died for eachother doesnt necessarily mean much with the problems they do have, which largely come down to the fact they lack a foundation for a real relationship, and they simply dont seem very compatible. Even when the two do have a real moment it never really feels like it's a relationship built to last to me, and there is also the point that as I've pointed out they are teenagers they arent exactly rational nor are they emotionally balanced. Plenty of relationships that are much more solid than Ranma and Akane fall apart or fail because teenagers simply dont really understand the concept of love.

As for Magic in Ranma 1/2
It does feel like magic isnt really consistently reliable in Ranma. Between the more shoddy seeming magics and just the fact much of it usually doesnt work out the way it's seemingly intended. I'd agree that often times the messups are on the characters, but it seems to be a near even split to me. It's always come across to me as a world where Magic does exist and isn't altogether uncommon given the frequency it's encountered however. A good example is the koi rod...It worked but also seemed to make its victim practically obsessed with the user to an extreme degree that Id say is probably not necessarily "as intended."
It's another one of those things that is open for interpretation I think, but its safe to say magic isnt necessarily something trustworthy within the Ranma 1/2 universe. Hell I've been considering doing a fic with a focus on it and focusing more on the mystical and stranger aspects of the Ranmaverse just because I dont see it explored in quite as much detail.

It's simply an aspect that is ill-explained mostly since most of Ranma canon events can be pulled out and switched around without any effect on the story, and it's never really addressed very well.
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Re: Head Canon

Postby Pata Hikari » Wed Jun 28, 2017 8:01 pm

AxelTheBunny wrote:TThe bamboo leaves really dont prove anything, as we are not aware of their effectiveness. It could work, or not.


Except for the part where they're explicitly said to work, the magic is shown working, and it's never shown backfiring. If there's evidence of the magic not working, where is it?

People can't criticize Takahashi for "not resolving things" and then ignore parts of the story that tell you how the resolution will go.

AxelTheBunny wrote:which largely come down to the fact they lack a foundation for a real relationship

The rest of the dumb fanon infulenced "Ranma and Akane are doooommmed" is so tired and overdone that there's no point in debunking it, again. (basically if anybody ever calls Akane "abusive" It's a sign they're not actually thinking of canon Ranma 1/2) But this is so absurd I have to comment on it.

Years of chapters showing them spending time together, building up a friendship, getting into fights, getting over said fights, helping each other, fighting for each other, isn't a "foundation for a real relationship"?
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Re: Head Canon

Postby AxelTheBunny » Wed Jun 28, 2017 8:41 pm

THere is evidence that couples were together. It could just as easily be a placebo type effect. As I said though I was merely stating that Magic in Ranma isnt typically reliable, and that it's stupid to say "THIS IS DEFINITELY WHAT HAPPENED" for parts of the story that dont exist. Even if the author may have intended to go that route, fanfiction is all about the What-ifs. Especially when it is as open ended as Ranma.




As for the "relationship is doomed" thing I was saying I felt the two werent compatible because their relationship doesnt have a romantic base. Im giving my opinion that the two really dont feel like a good couple to me, because of a lack of real chemistry. Also that one needs to remember these are freaking teenagers, not exactly the point in ones life where all other paths close off.

THey have the foundation for a friendship, but if you really think that they have some unbreakable romantic bond then you are being idealistic. I was also merely sharing my opinion on the matter. simply having emotions for eachother isnt enough for a relationship to work out. Hell look at one of their biggest issue, communication. This is an essential part of any stable relationship. The two also simply have issues getting along. It's never felt like a good romance in my opinion. This isnt to say they couidnt fix these issues. Im merely stating that as their relationship is at the end of the manga, it could easily still go a number of different ways. Including the route of being "doomed."

At the end of the day, there isnt a definitive resolution, no clear "They all ended up this way." Which is why Ranma 1/2 is so interesting to look at in terms of fanfiction. Yes I can see she intended to say Ranma and Akane did end up together. But as I said it could still have actually gone differently.

I'd also point out Physical assault on a partner is typically abuse. though this DOES happen more in the anime than the manga. Manga Akane does get violent on occasion as well usually for what is essentially misunderstandings. It doesnt matter what a person's justification is. However as said this is mostly just part of the slapstick I just pointed out that if one looks at it without that slapstick tone then it takes a different meaning. Akane in manga only really does become violent in a few cases but it still happens. It's the type of thing that changes dependent on the tone of a story, or crossover you would go with.



Also as stated this was my opinion and reasoning on the matter. You are free to disagree with it, but I'm equally free to not care.

I usually try to leave things open ended when it comes to relationships in Ranma anyways. Because Romance is largely not my prefered genre for writing. I'll give a nod to it, but usually (with the except of one of my stories where I literally tried to look for the least believable pairing I could find and see if I could make it work in a believable way_ I usually prefer to focus on action/adventure anyway.
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Re: Head Canon

Postby Pata Hikari » Wed Jun 28, 2017 9:35 pm

AxelTheBunny wrote:THere is evidence that couples were together. It could just as easily be a placebo type effect. As I said though I was merely stating that Magic in Ranma isnt typically reliable, and that it's stupid to say "THIS IS DEFINITELY WHAT HAPPENED" for parts of the story that dont exist. Even if the author may have intended to go that route, fanfiction is all about the What-ifs. Especially when it is as open ended as Ranma.


No. It's not a placebo type effect. Because an effect of having your name put on the leaf, and then having it taken off and placed on someone else's leaf is shown. So the leaves are definately real magic, and since that effect is shown as real, what reason is there to doubt the other effects?

Again, where's the evidence, from the story, that this magic won't work?

Things happen in stories for a reason. Takahashi put that chapter in there to say a specific thing about Ranma 1/2. You can't discount that by just saying "Well anything could happen" because it didn't happen, it's a finished story.

One of the central questions of Ranma 1/2 was whether or not Ranma and Akane would be together and someday get married. This chapter answers that with a yes. While I'd love for the ending to also explain how this would come to pass, Takahashi chose to, for whatever reason, leave that to the readers imagination.
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Re: Head Canon

Postby AxelTheBunny » Wed Jun 28, 2017 10:03 pm

I think this is where we differ, I take a skeptical approach to this. As I dont recall seeing long term couples as a result of this magic. It's just an open ended "Destiny" thing. I do recall it altering behavior when their leaves are placed with others. I had to go back because I was mixing up this with another chapter, as its been a bit since I've gone through the manga, but I do recall it actually altered the behavior of Ranma and Akane based on whos tree their leaf was attached.
As that is how love magic seems to work with Ranma. IDK I just think it's silly to assume it WOULD work as well, because we dont really have an assurance of the long term effect and similar besides as said. Hell I've always hated the idea of characters being "FATED" to do anything. It's BS because it assumes a static future no matter what actions are taken. Hell I made Ancient Oath mostly to see how I can mess with the idea of magic binding people together without altering their individual wills, and I still highly doubt that it'd actually end up in an actual romance.

Besides considering how many oneshot arc exist in Ranma 1/2 that are meaningless it's rather silly to assume that one holds weight. But I do believe Takahashi INTENDED to say Ranma and Akane were meant to be together,
I merely said they never felt right together. It's one of those issues where you and I probably just have a differing idea of what makes a good fanfiction and likely of the characters and story in general

I believe a story is dictated by the actions of it's characters more so than the will of it's author. I think this is because I come at story writing from a different viewpoint, as I started writing fiction from RP and not fanfiction like many others. and moved from original works to fanfiction.

I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree with alot of this.
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Re: Head Canon

Postby Pata Hikari » Wed Jun 28, 2017 10:43 pm

AxelTheBunny wrote: IDK I just think it's silly to assume it WOULD work as well, because we dont really have an assurance of the long term effect and similar besides as said. Hell I've always hated the idea of characters being "FATED" to do anything. It's BS because it assumes a static future no matter what actions are taken.


That isn't how fiction works.

If it wasn't supposed to be clear, if there was meant to be ambiguity in if it worked or not, the story would tell us that.

Also this magic literally only happened because Ranma and Akane chose to put their names on the leaves. So their actions clearly do mean something. The thing is the romance between them came first. Ranma and Akane are already a couple by the time they chose to do this, so it's simply quiet reassurance to the reader that everything will work out fine.

AxelTheBunny wrote:Besides considering how many oneshot arc exist in Ranma 1/2 that are meaningless it's rather silly to assume that one holds weight.


Just because a story is episodic (like Ranma 1/2 is mostly) does not mean that each individual episode is meaningless. This episode in particular has a lot of meaning for what it says about the two protagonists.

AxelTheBunny wrote:I believe a story is dictated by the actions of it's characters more so than the will of it's author.


And by the actions of Ranma and Akane in the story they're going to be married some day by the end of the series.

AxelTheBunny wrote:I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree with alot of this.


"Agree to disagree" really only works when dealing with opinions. This particular point is a matter of fact. I don't care if you don't like Akane, even though it's a dumb opinion, but the fact is that by the end of the story she and Ranma love each other and will get married some day. If you want to write a fanfic that diverges from canon before this fact becomes inevitable, feel free, but don't try and say that the original manga doesn't say that.
Last edited by Pata Hikari on Wed Jun 28, 2017 11:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Head Canon

Postby AxelTheBunny » Wed Jun 28, 2017 11:05 pm

As stated, just because they love eachother doesnt mean they are "destined to be together." Anyone who believes "love" is all that is necessary for a real lasting relationship. May i reiterate these are TEENAGERS... relationships made by teenagers arent exactly set in stone. as I said, i can see a number of possible outcomes...but to say its an inevitability they'd be happily married is naive. Falling out of love is a thing and I've seen it happen.

As for Akane, yes she wasnt a character I enjoyed viewing. As her personality was always grating to me, and failed to grab my interest the way other characters did. However Im not under the impression she's some kind of shedevil nor have I stated otherwise. Her actions often times in a realistic context would have been classified as abusive, this is all I stated.


The actions of Ranma and Akane show they care for eachother and are likely to end up in a relationship but this does not mean that relationship will work out favorably. Despite my dislike of the character I DO strive to portray her fairly.

As for fiction, there is no set way a story works, I tend to write based off how people actually act and try to understand personalities and relations from a realistic if somewhat cynical point of view. And I dont recall you having any sort of special status that allows you authority over what is and isnt how fiction works. Just because that is what you personally get out of this chapter doesnt mean anything.

As I said it's implied they will attempt, and maybe succeed but stating its fact that events that didnt happen in the manga totally happened is a matter of opinion. Maybe they did get married, and be happy, but they could have also ended up divorcing later on or never making it to that stage.

There are no facts about what happened after the manga because there is no story after the manga. It was foreshadowing that they would probably be married happily.

Now can we please let this go, it really isnt that important.
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Re: Head Canon

Postby Pata Hikari » Wed Jun 28, 2017 11:18 pm

AxelTheBunny wrote:As stated, just because they love eachother doesnt mean they are "destined to be together." Anyone who believes "love" is all that is necessary for a real lasting relationship. May i reiterate these are TEENAGERS... relationships made by teenagers arent exactly set in stone. as I said, i can see a number of possible outcomes...but to say its an inevitability they'd be happily married is naive. Falling out of love is a thing and I've seen it happen.


Ranma 1/2 is a romantic comedy. Of course it's going to have the main characters in a lasting relationship.

AxelTheBunny wrote:. Her actions often times in a realistic context would have been classified as abusive, this is all I stated.


Well good thing Ranma 1/2 doesn't take place in world with "realistic context" then!

It takes place in a world where the Principal throwing bombs at students is an annoyance at worst. A world where people don't find random oaths of eternal vengeance (over petty grudges) all that odd. A world where a girl can have her giant pig beat people up in search of a boyfriend and nobody bats an eye. A world where the single biggest crime we see actually committed, to the point of angry mobs forming, is panty thieving.

In a more "realistic context" Ranma 1/2 at its core would not work as a world. If you did transplant the characters, they would not act the same way they do in canon. A "Realistic Akane" would not bean Ranma over the head with a table. A "Realistic Ranma" would not land on people's heads to say hello. A "Realistic Ryoga" would not get lost in a hallway. If you're going to reinterpret the characters into a realistic world, you need to reinterpret their actions as well.

AxelTheBunny wrote:As for fiction, there is no set way a story works, I tend to write based off how people actually act and try to understand personalities and relations from a realistic if somewhat cynical point of view.


See above. In other words the most Akane should have ever done to Ranma if you're going to be "realistic" is slapping him in the face.

AxelTheBunny wrote:As I said it's implied they will attempt, and maybe succeed but stating its fact that events that didnt happen in the manga totally happened is a matter of opinion.


Except I've already said that they took actions to literally guarentee they will get married in the future. We know for a fact that will happen from the facts the story tells us. We just don't know the how.

AxelTheBunny wrote:Now can we please let this go, it really isnt that important.


Actually, it is. The core of Ranma 1/2 is Ranma and Akane's relationship. To say that it will never work out or that they'll just break up later renders the entire story meaningless.
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Re: Head Canon

Postby HopeSeiketsu » Thu Jun 29, 2017 12:40 am

welp i have had fun lurking and watching this debate but i suppose i should just put my two cents in.

pata stop trying to force your ideal and beliefs on others, no matter how justified they may be based on cannon examples that is just not cool imo. i have a modified saying for you if you cant say anything nice or politly cunstroctive dont say anything at all.


P.S the fact that it is a romantic comedy is and has always seemed more like a bad joke even though it is listed that way. also i have to agree with axel on the not feeling like a relationship would work out between them in the long run. just too many issues with their personalities that without counseling are not likely to be solved in the nerima envirement
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Re: Head Canon

Postby Spica75 » Thu Jun 29, 2017 3:42 am

Pata Hikari wrote:
No. It's not a placebo type effect. Because an effect of having your name put on the leaf, and then having it taken off and placed on someone else's leaf is shown. So the leaves are definately real magic, and since that effect is shown as real, what reason is there to doubt the other effects?

Again, where's the evidence, from the story, that this magic won't work?

Things happen in stories for a reason. Takahashi put that chapter in there to say a specific thing about Ranma 1/2. You can't discount that by just saying "Well anything could happen" because it didn't happen, it's a finished story.

One of the central questions of Ranma 1/2 was whether or not Ranma and Akane would be together and someday get married. This chapter answers that with a yes. While I'd love for the ending to also explain how this would come to pass, Takahashi chose to, for whatever reason, leave that to the readers imagination.


Wow... You realise you just stood up and proclaimed your fanon as canon? Good job.
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Re: Head Canon

Postby Pata Hikari » Thu Jun 29, 2017 10:25 pm

Spica75 wrote:Wow... You realise you just stood up and proclaimed your fanon as canon? Good job.


Uh, no I didn't.

I did not spontaneously create a Fan Theory or fanfic plot device that is used and spread around to the point where people mistake it for canon. (Heck, I can only think of two fanfics that even mention the Bamboo Leaves of Love.)

What I did was make a little comment on how the ending to Ranma 1/2 isn't as vague and open as initial thoughts about the ending people may have (usually because most people didn't learn about how Ranma 1/2 ends by reading it, but by out of context internet spoilers) by pointing to an event earlier in the story. It was a minor point about the broader discussion of characterization.

HopeSeiketsu wrote:P.S the fact that it is a romantic comedy is and has always seemed more like a bad joke even though it is listed that way. also i have to agree with axel on the not feeling like a relationship would work out between them in the long run. just too many issues with their personalities that without counseling are not likely to be solved in the nerima envirement


See this? This is fanon.

It's not the "nerima environment" it's the world. The Nerima Ward is not some weird special place that all this craziness Ranma is dumped into. The entire world of Ranma 1/2 is like that. It's a silly place.
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Re: Head Canon

Postby Té Rowan » Fri Jun 30, 2017 1:45 pm

Long ago I began assuming that any given Foo-verse fanfic occurs in a universe more or less parallel to the Foo canon works. Hey, I like keeping my blood pressure nice’n’sleazy.
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