Need a map of the roads of the Western coast of North Americ

[Cheb]

Thank you, everyone!

This topic is closed.

After twisting my brain in attempts to pinpoint the locations of Big Empty and The Divide -- unsuccessfully -- I decided to brute-force the issue, placing these locations as plot and logic dictate.

1. Big Empty straddles I-15, close enough to it to threaten traffic (as it is mentioned that its existence prevented caravan routes from forming between the Boneyard and New Vegas). I thus assume that trafic from Mojave outpost doesn't go along I-15 but turns north along 127, making the area around and to the east of Necropolis (which I assume to be Barstow) a sort of blank spot where people disappear too often to travel through. So the route from Hub to Vegas would go north through NCR capital, then south through the Death valley, then North again. That would rationalize why Vegas wasn't explored during FO2 even if it seems close by when you look atthe map.
2. The Divide is placed in such a way that when it forms, it blocks 160, possibly making the usage using 127 difficult. What is most vexing - and mysterious - is that 95 must be impassable (as it is mentioned that the NCR scouts first reached the Hoover Dam, *then* the Vegas ruins.)

Well, I I can use the ass-pull of "landscape being saturated with faults" for the 95. Kinda, the war had triggered some nasty tectonic effects :\

P.S. Uh, maybe the area being inhabited by Deathclaws is a factor? Even these beasts are nothing against a regular army... Except when they have a *reputation*, and the said army shits bricks at the first mention of them. *Especially* if they breed there in numbers.

yet at the same time useful due to being able to use it without worrying about connections or power.

As I noticed, the internet map have a nasty problem of the small details disappearing too soon as you zoom out. So the paper maps win by simply being packed more densely with information.

[Spokavriel]

Just have some bombs targeted at Nellis and the Arizona Power plants. The ordinance chain reactions and nuclear fallout would be enough energy to explain sections at the sides of the traditional grand canyon splitting into the opening and breaking roads to either side. And keep people away from making repairs. Threat of a radioactive wind coming in from Arizona.

[Cheb]

Just have some bombs targeted at Nellis

I can't. It's the canon that Nellis is intact, a home for the former Vault 34 inhabitants.
It's also a canon fact that Vegas was spared of bombing, the surrounding desert is almost clean... Maybe they all landed to the north-west of Vegas, though? Because 95 goes north-west of Vegas, and that's the shortest route towards NCR.

and the Arizona Power plants.

Hmmm... Assume there were some power plants along the 95? That works. Radiation from a power plant meltdown can be much more long-lived than from a nuke.
In fact, the most radioactive locations in FO:NV (as well as FO2, btw.) are leaking nuclear reactors.
P.S. In-game, the map edge cutting across 95 is formed by "radioactive waste dump" as the highway can be seen going further into the distance. Hmmm...

P.P.S. Also, radiation from nukes in FOverse is still potent after 200+ years, while IRL the ground zero is safe after only 50.

[Spokavriel]

Look up a little place called Indian Springs. Its just south of the unofficial but still easy to walk to area 51. There is ordinance storage there not just practice rounds that is the usual for air shows and drills over at Nellis.

[Spica75]

Have you tried if you can get more of what you need from using google earth with the satellite ( instead of map ) setting?

Right now i´m looking at a parking lot just next to Nellis AFB and they have up to the highest zoom, meaning that you can see individual trees and bushes, and have a fair chance to identify a car if it looks unusual.

[PCHeintz72]

Have you tried if you can get more of what you need from using google earth with the satellite ( instead of map ) setting?

Right now i´m looking at a parking lot just next to Nellis AFB and they have up to the highest zoom, meaning that you can see individual trees and bushes, and have a fair chance to identify a car if it looks unusual.

Wow, I'm surprised the Military allows that, I would have assumed they would force Google to blur or otherwise artificially make it just block level diagrams on military bases. For security reasons as I can assume a lot of ill intent could be done with that kind of info... Sure it is not like it is building layouts and interior or underground facilities... but still.

[Spokavriel]

Showing images from normal appearance passes is less suspicious. It's not like the orbits and images aren't being displayed without first being approved.

[Cheb]

area 51.

As I understand it's too far to the East and thus is not present in the games.

99% of action will be confined to a combined map of FO1, FO2 and FO:NV. That is, lake Mead is its East border, Los Angeles is its soutern border and Klamath is near its northern border.

There is no need for details, except the natural and/or historical landmarks: the world of Fallout was FUBAR even before it got nuked in 2077. There are cities that have no equivalents IRL (ex. Ashton / Hopeville). There is a fact of either Bakersfield being 100 km to the east or Barstow being a major city. And so on.

P.S. Nellis *did* get nuked, but it mostly faded after 100+ years. Meaning, it was still radioactive as hell during FO1 (80 years after the war), but probably passable during FO2 (160 years after the war).

My fic takes place during the events of FO2 but uses some locations from FO:NV with corrections as it is 40 years too early. There is no Legion yet, most of the Vaults around Vegas are still sealed, and the Lucky 38 is still playing possum.

Wow, I'm surprised the Military allows that,

But you don't know how accurate it is. It may keep high resolution, but be distorted enough to make aiming artillery using it impossible. Note that none of these maps have elevation data, unlike the traditional paper maps.
Plus, there's no much sense inr such secrecy now. The world is quite transparent, everyone sees everything.

[PCHeintz72]

But you don't know how accurate it is. It may keep high resolution, but be distorted enough to make aiming artillery using it impossible. Note that none of these maps have elevation data, unlike the traditional paper maps.
Plus, there's no much sense inr such secrecy now. The world is quite transparent, everyone sees everything.

That is not really true though. it is more accurate that everyone sees what they want to see or are made to see... there are still secrets, still stuff that corporations and government would prefer very much indeed to not see the light of day.

[Spokavriel]

Just FYI. All of area 51 is north and West of Las Vegas. So is the Public location of Indian Springs which does, public info, store ordinance for the air force. If Indian Springs were a little less far north it would be entirely between Vegas and California. (Meaning none of NV would be seen as being on the other side of town if it were further south.)

[Spica75]

Wow, I'm surprised the Military allows that, I would have assumed they would force Google to blur or otherwise artificially make it just block level diagrams on military bases. For security reasons as I can assume a lot of ill intent could be done with that kind of info... Sure it is not like it is building layouts and interior or underground facilities... but still.

They don´t have a choice in the matter, as the google satellite images does not come from military satellites. Nor to a large extent from US satellites. And much of the zoomed in imagery is simply just common aerial photography.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Maps
Although Google uses the word satellite, most of the high-resolution imagery of cities is aerial photography taken from aircraft flying at 800 feet (240 m) to 1,500 feet (460 m); however, most of the other imagery is from satellites.

I believe most of the detailed imagery comes from the French http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spot_Image commercial "Spot" satellites. 2.5m resolution is the best used for Google Earth, the best Spot satellite today can manage 1.5m resolution, while the best available commercially at all is 0.31m resolution however.
Since 2008 Google also gets high res images from GeoEye-1, at 0.5m resolution(and this IS a US company(which is why Google isnt getting photos at 0.41m resolution that the satellite tops out at)).

However, there´s a such a big bundle of satellites around today with that level of resolution, that trying to force everyone to not spread pictures would be seriously futile.
China, France, Germany, India, Israel, Italy, Japan, South Korea, Turkey and UK all have commercial companies with high resolution satellites up and running.

And even more countries launch shortlived photo satellites on a commercial basis for various tasks.
Sweden is for example looking at launching suborbital satellites over the north pole, as a way to get a reliable photographic trace of the arctic icecap and flows(most sats doesn´t repeat the exact same orbit, and few go straight across the arctic the desired route) from Esrange, probably having them come down somewhere in the northwest Alaska.

Essentially, the avalanche was coming, trying to stop it from happening was futile. High resolution satellites were becoming something MANY countries could manage. And like i said above, most of the close up photos is actually taken locally with aircrafts.

[Cheb]

Essentially, the avalanche was coming, trying to stop it from happening was futile.

So true.
They had to change their views on what is considered secret.

All of area 51 is north and West of Las Vegas.

Added it.
Also found a valley pockmarked with craters. Added it too.

Here is my current version, using following assumptions:

1. The land around Area 51 contained 10 times as much military presence as it does IRL. The proving grounds were *much* larger, taking up several valleys. The bases got nuked. There were also several power plants in underground bunkers. Many got damaged and/or went into meltdown, causing lasting contamination. The whole area is impassable, populated with feral Glowing Ones.

2. The Mariposa military base has nothing to do with RL Mariposa. This is cover story BS.

3. The Big Empty was never Big Mt., that's a cover story BS to confuse spies. There was never a mountain to begin with. First, some experiment (non-nuclear!) went kaboom resulting in a big crater. Then, a research facility was built inside that crater. *After* the kaboom.

Use right-click + View Image to see its right half that gets clipped.

[Spokavriel]

Not bad. But you might want to add some reasoning for the yellow lines in your map key.

[Cheb]

Oh.
Yellow and cyan lines are roads as mapquest.com shows them in satellite mode. I just highlighted them (select by color + enlarge selection + fill)