Then there is akane, she has never gone out and kept fighting someone until she won.
That's the Kurumi and Natsume fight.Wyrd wrote:It was pointed out to me earlier today that this is not the case. There was one fight in the anime where Akane lost, then went and seriously trained before coming back to win.
toushin wrote:i think ranma is actually really insecure about himself much more then your average high school student and i can take a multitude of examples from the series to prove this. He isn't secure in his looks girls like shampoo, kodachi, and ukyo throw themselves at him; he uses his curse form to con people out of free food. yet all Tsubasa had to do was call ranma ugly and he was able to get ranma to enter a contest to see who was the cutest. The fact that ranma wasn't wining caused him to go and put a ridicules playboy bunny costume and this had nothing to do with martial arts. The reversal jewel arc can also be used. if shampoo had just went up to ranma and calmly said we just don't work out, ect. I truly believe that, that would be the end of it. But to suddenly go from loving him to out right hating him means that there is something wrong with him. It wasn't anything really cruel on his part he just needed to no what was wrong with him and did it the only way he knew how.
He isn't secure in manhood the curse, genma's constant criticism, as well as akane's, see's to that. The mere fact that he waited so long to confese to his mother is proff alone but if you want more. Look at every time a man has told ranma-chan he's loved her. When kuno had said it ranma froze and had violent nightmares, when ryoga said it he beat him to within an inch of his life. By the end of the manga he was getting more used to the curse so when the hot spring owner told ranma that he loved her she didn't beat him up but she didn't let him lay a finger on her. If ranma was comfortable with himself these things wouldn't have such a profound effect. The ice skating match is also a great example while ranma was willing to go through it he was willing to do it as a boy.
toushin wrote:Then there is intelligence, while ranma acts nonchalant in school he does seem to care if just a little. In vol 27 when principle kuno stole everyone’s test scores. Everyone said that ranma must know that he had gotten a bad score because he had fought so hard to prevent them from being seen. When we finally see the scores ranma was fine with it while genma berated him by not realizing that the news shouldn’t be able to show them. Meaning that as long as he isn’t embarrassed he doesn’t care..
toushin wrote:Then there is martial arts, unlike what fanon perceives I don’t think refusing to lose is a tenant of anything goes. There are numerous instances where that proves to be the case. In the dojo destroyer arc both genma and soun lost, yet in no way tried to redeem that fact. Instead they pawned the problem off on akane and ranma. Even though really as masters of the style getting the sign back was their responsibility. Ranma and akane jobs would have been to defend the sign not get it back. Genma pawning off happosai to ranma is another example of this. In fact the only time genma fought a rematch was when ranma finally got strong enough to beat him regularly. Then there is akane, she has never gone out and kept fighting someone until she won. While she has never backed down from a challenge which seems to be the real tenant of the style once she’s lost that’s the end of it. She might lament about it but she never goes out of her way to re fight the person until they attack her again. I think ranma fights so hard not to loose is because martial arts is really the only thing he has confidence in.
Admitting defeat would mean giving up the only thing that makes him worth anything. This is probably on a scale even higher then the neko-ken in ways genma has screwed with ranma’s mind. If he suffers a loss that he knows he cannot do anything about, he becomes despondent. Extremely proud of his abilities, he feels humiliated by even one setback. When this happens, he becomes obsessed with avenging his defeat in another battle. He fears only the possibility that he might not be able to do so, even with sufficient training, under these circumstances. But nothing of that will stop him from trying. The best example of this is how he learned the Mökö Takabisha in the first place. Ryoga comes along with a technique that ranma has no idea how to perform and no way to counter it. Ranma first desperately tries to recreate it, when that doesn’t work he asks cologne for advise. She tells him that he won’t be able to master it; he fights ryoga again, and loses again. He exen tries to sneak a peak at the scroll and is stopped. Finally ranma sits down and broads. Ryoga has finally beat him with a technique he has no way of countering and everyone says he can’t learn. Finally with that though in mind he instinctually uses the shi shi hokodan.
Its instances like these where we really see ranma at his worse. But even nonchalantly blasting away his father is no match for what he does when someone uses magical weapons against him. Ranma wasn’t really that bad in the super soba arc, akane coming out as more of the bad guy, but the moment she lost her strength he forced her to arm wrestle him over and over again. This was more for himself then to humiliate akane, it allowed him to reaffirm that she couldn’t beat him in a fair fight. The battle dogi arc is where we really see ranma in a bad light. He went so far as seducing akane to get her to get rid of the suit. Even though he realized what he was doing was wrong the moment he did it. I also believe that if akane kept using those items he would have never forgiven her.
The fact that he went through with it in the first place says a lot. Some of you may argue that ranma is willing to use magical weapon and has. But if you remember he only uses those weapons once. The fire breathing pacifier and the electric ring shows this. Ranma used only to counter the invisible glasses and you never saw them again. I don’t remember if he gave them back or kept them. Winning means everything to ranma he doesn’t care if he has to fall in love with a man, he doesn’t care if has to wear revealing lingerie, he doesn’t even care if he can walk afterwards as long as he can say he won.
This is likely the reason ranma fanfiction and ranma ½ it’s self is so popular. Even though it’s a comedy if you look under the slap stick you see incredibly complex flawed characters. Ranma couldn’t possible be the confident person he makes himself out to be because a confident person wouldn’t act the way he does.
toushin wrote:He isn't secure in manhood the curse, genma's constant criticism, as well as akane's, see's to that. The mere fact that he waited so long to confese to his mother is proff alone but if you want more. Look at every time a man has told ranma-chan he's loved her. When kuno had said it ranma froze and had violent nightmares, when ryoga said it he beat him to within an inch of his life. By the end of the manga he was getting more used to the curse so when the hot spring owner told ranma that he loved her she didn't beat him up but she didn't let him lay a finger on her. If ranma was comfortable with himself these things wouldn't have such a profound effect. The ice skating match is also a great example while ranma was willing to go through it he was willing to do it as a boy.
Kyoumen wrote:2) Ranma freaks out at men being attracted to him because Ranma is macho and homophobic, not because Ranma is insecure. It's worth noting that Ranma quite literally thinks the definition of "lesbian" is "woman who has not yet met Ranma Saotome" (see the Tsubasa story). It is not particularly uncommon, unfortunately, for guys (particularly macho jocks) to react like this.
Zwzn wrote:Ranma in canon does not care if you can beat him. He was out right happy Akane could out fight him when she first got the magic dogi, and he did not care if he basically lost the martial arts cheer leading. He can't stand people who treat others with disrespect such as Akane quickly starts to do whenever she gets a power up.
toushin wrote:he never said that, he came to the conclusion to date tsubasa after he hounded him, and after ukyo said that tsubasa hated boys. it reaaly seemed like another one of ranma's spur of the moment ideas. while he did say he wanted to put her on the right path i really never saw it as homophobia as a reaction to something completely new.
also while kuno steadily denies defeat, that is more of him not excepting reality then lack of confidence. like the fact that he's seen and felt ranma change but still thinks their different people.
Kyoumen wrote:I can't say I really see that as an interpretation of what struck me as a fairly unambiguous line, but regardless, his reactions to any and all male affection towards him are pretty blatantly homophobic; moreover, they are intended to be comedic in the time-honoured-and-increasingly-unpolitically-correct vein of "guy hits on macho guy, who freaks out, hilarity ensues". Takahashi is a lot of things, but I wouldn't say "socially progressive" is one of them.
toushin wrote:
Everybody say’s that the super soba and the battle dogi arcs show Ranma at his worse, but they also show Akane at hers. During the super soba arc the lords her strength over everyone and never once caring that fighting in official matches was completely unfair. While this is more of her just being happy with a new toy, in the battle dogi arc she is horrible. Once again she lords her new strength over Ranma, then beats him half to death when he challenges her. She even tells him he’s just jealous that she is a better “Martial artist”. During their third match she beats and insults Ranma to the point where he is pissed off enough to attack her when he does she acts as if he betrayed her. She continues to beat him up calling him a coward, weakling ect. When she pisses him off again enough to attack her that if he does she will never forgive him. Then she get’s angry that he doesn’t stop fighting, even after all she has done to him.
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