Speculation on why Ranma allows people to abuse him

[Nekomata-sensei]

While I agree with the slapstick comments. I think a big part of what makes Ranma a sympathetic character and kept me reading the manga was the hope for something to go right for him (which it very rarely does, and only then, usually by extreeme unrecognized effort on his part). I recognized that Ranma was abused right away, and felt for him/her. There were a few times when I enjoyed the slapstick comedy (usually when it happened to characters I allready found despicable), but that was rarely, I much more enjoyed other comedy points and the action martial arts aspects, and felt sad or frustrated when Ranma was abused.
Perhaps it's one of the reasons I never much liked bugs bunny and daffy duck cartoons (where often a relatively innocent character takes punishement) but liked Tom and Jerry and Roadrunner cartoons (where the one who suffers from the slapstick is usually trying to eat or otherwise hurt the clever, more innocent character). I personally find it disgusting that some people actually enjoy seeing Ranma get smacked and otherwise hurt, and have regularly enjoyed stories where all of Ranma's problems get solved, even if characters end up acting rather ooc.
That said, I think Ranma allows himself to be hurt for a different reason, related to reflexes and spiritual awareness. There is a difference between an opponent who is seriously fighting him, and one who is 'punishing' him for some reason. Ranma's danger sense doesn't seem to apply to things like rogue baseballs or otherwise non-attacks that might hurt him. There are indications that show Ranma has some strong spiritual awareness, he reacts defensively to killing intent or challenging attacks, attacks meant to defeat him or kill him, or attacks of a sparring nature, but his danger senses completely ignore any sort of punishment or odd disasters that befall him.
This could be constrewed as a subconcious empathic ability, which could also help explain his learning rate for martial arts techniques, if he actually telepathically absorbs some of the technique's execution from an opponent using it against him. For non-combative attacks, his trained reflexes don't work, because they're almost entirely supernaturally based. This makes sneaking techniques that suppress ki and such things like that particularly effective against Ranma.
An empathic ability indicates Ranma can feel the pain of others, this makes him more sympathetic to their plights, because he too knows what it's like to suffer. It takes a lot to make Ranma really angry, and usually only pampered characters who don't know real pain and suffering can provoke him, such as Mikaido Sanezin or Saffron.
Ranma is also, in my opinion, good at heart, and puts others above himself, not just because of his upbringing or his empathic ability, or even his sense of self worth or honor, but because Ranma has an inherent understanding of a sort of basic morality, possibly due to being a victim so often, or perhaps for other reasons. If someone see's an attack against him as justified, because of his empathic ability, part of him sees it from their own point of view, and thus, he allows himself to be punished out of guilt, since he doesn't have the logical skills, thanks to his poor upbringing, to fully realize it's not his fault. Ranma repeatedly shows that he'll work hard to help those in need with no expected reward, just out of the kindness of his heart, he doesn't want to hurt others, even when they hurt him, he'll take punishment to make others feel better. He seems to inherently understand the lesson learned by Peter Parker from the death of Ben Parker, that with great power, comes great responsibility.
Ranma is one of the few in the Ranma1/2 series who rarely abuses his martial arts skills, he's not a bully, he protects the weak and innocent, he asks questions first, and fights later, and is quick to forgive. Even Kasumi and Dr. Tofu are portrayed as slightly evil compared to Ranma, Kasumi is known to do petty things with her chores as revenge when people upset her, tends to be superficial and overly traditional, and seemed to derive pleasure from causing Ranma suffering by piling cats on Ranma when his phobia was discovered. Dr. Tofu often injuries patients and destroys property in Kasumi's presence, and despite being mentally unstable in this way, seems to not be doing anything to correct his behavior, despite his moral responsilibities as a doctor (he shows additional lack of judgement in hiring Genma as a janitor in panda form), he enjoys sneaking up on people and spooking them, and he likes to run away or hide from his problems, like when he has onna-Ranma pretending to be his fiancee for his mother.
Ranma is just about the only character who really has excuses for almost all of his bad behavior. I can't think of anything off the top of my head that was unjustified or couldn't be explained away by his upbringing or recent circumstances causing lapses of judgement. He's also one of the few characters who regularly tries to correct their mistakes and feels true regret.
I think Ranma is reserved because of what makes him good. Not only does he not want to fall to the level of those around him, but he also seeks their approval and to be seen as good by them, even if that means taking undeserved punishment.

[lwf58]

So how come there are no endless debates over familial abuse about the Three Stooges? They were much worse, and it was live action!
Of course it's because it's a comedy.

[Nekomata-sensei]

So how come there are no endless debates over familial abuse about the Three Stooges? They were much worse, and it was live action!
Of course it's because it's a comedy.

Actually, I draw the line quite a ways away from that. I'm mostly disgusted by the Three Stooges, I can't really find it that funny watching people hurt each other pointlessly and make lame jokes with overly simple punchlines. But I _like_ Ranma 1/2, just not for it's slapstick comedy, in the sense of it being a slapstick comedy, but for the characters and character interactions and following Ranma's fights and adventures.
While the slapstick comedy elements of Ranma 1/2 do help it from the point of view of engaging me, it is more because I feel sympathy and worry for Ranma and am hoping his problems get solved. (I hoped for quite a while that he'd end up with Ukyo, since she's one of the few mentally stable characters in the series, if a bit obsessed.) I feel a slight pain in my heart every time Ranma gets injured or caused pain unjustly, no matter how temporary the injury or pain.
Remember, there are three unforgivable curses in Harry Potter, the Imperious (mind control), the Killing Curse (duh), and the Crutiatus (the pain curse). Causing pain to punish someone is morally reprehensible IMO. Admittedly, it might have to do with how I was raised, since my parents almost never used corpral punishment on me. (I'm a good kid. I've seen people's wrists slapped with rulers by teachers and my brothers and sisters get spanked when they've misbehaved. The only times I've ever been 'punished' physically was an older step sister who hit me a few times when I accidentally made enough noise pouring ceral in the mornings to wake her up (very light sleeper and grumpy in the mornings) and once when my step dad choked me when he was off his meds and hadn't smoked in over 24 hours because of a plane ride, thus, I've never been punished like that for a reason).
I've seen that kids who's parents use corpral punishment tend to be less able to control themselves when there is no adults around to watch them. I won't say this is neccesarily the fault of the parents, I know that some kids just have bad brain chemistry. My step brother has severe autism and a chemical imbalance in his brain that makes him have to take medication or have wild fits and amnesia, unable to form coherent thoughts. I myself have a slightly inactive frontal lobe and left temporal lobe which makes very impaired at coding, keeping track of time, and connecting and remembering names and faces but otherwise I'm in the genius range for things. I also have Aspergers's Syndrome (a lesser form of autism), and I have a cousin who also has autism who has a bad stuttering problem, despite being much smarter than me and more eloquent when he doesn't have to come up with the words while talking (such as when reading aloud or giving a speach).
But it's not all nature, a lot of it is nurture, and my parents exposed me to a lot of good morals growing up, they read me bedtime stories and helped me read them, they got me to share with siblings, they had me watch shows like Seseme Steet, Reading Rainbow, Disney movies, and other forms of childrens entertainment with morals and learning involved, rather than shows focusing on violence (say, Power Rangers), general stupidity and poor morals (Simpsons, South Park), and slapstick comedy (most Warner Bros. cartoons) like many parents have their kids watch these days. And they encouraged me in creative endevours (art and music), cooperative nonviolent excersize (soccer, swimming, gymnastics) and in positive, helpful games like Lemmings, where you build a safe path for the little critters to follow so that they don't walk to their dooms.
In Ranma, even with poor nurture, a good nature can bring up a relatively good kid. Ranma, despite being raised with violence by a lying, cowardly, cheating, stealing, irresponsible, greedy, bastard of a father, is brave, powerful, helpful, mostly honorable, andvery well meaning.

[nuclear death frog]

Remember, there are three unforgivable curses in Harry Potter, the Imperious (mind control), the Killing Curse (duh), and the Crutiatus (the pain curse).

Imperius isn't just mind control -- it's absolute dominance of another's actions unless the victim has the strength of will to resist it, and that quality is shown to be rare. Only Harry has shown himself able to quickly throw off Imperius.
And Cruciatus isn't just pain, it's physical *torture* which can render its victims insane.

[lwf58]

I can see that this has the potential to veer off into a discussion of HP, so I'll nip that before it begins. We're talking about Ranma here, so even though side references are okay, stay on topic.

[Amarielah]

Perhaps it's one of the reasons I never much liked bugs bunny and daffy duck cartoons (where often a relatively innocent character takes punishement) but liked Tom and Jerry and Roadrunner cartoons (where the one who suffers from the slapstick is usually trying to eat or otherwise hurt the clever, more innocent character). I personally find it disgusting that some people actually enjoy seeing Ranma get smacked and otherwise hurt, and have regularly enjoyed stories where all of Ranma's problems get solved, even if characters end up acting rather ooc.

Wow, it's the exact opposite with me. I sympathize with Tom, because I felt that Jerry was excessively cruel to the poor cat. Tom was almost always just doing what the Lady of the house wanted him to do (for fear of being kicked out of the house, no less), and Jerry took genuine delight in actively humiliating him. Jerry could have easily been a gracious winner-- but then it wouldn't have been entertaining, would it? In the exact same way, Ranma just wouldn't be Ranma if everything went his way. Ranma without chaos is like Ataru without Lum, or Excel without The Pit, or Sousuke without Kaname, or Kyle without Cartman--one just isn't the same when the other is missing. I don't enjoy Ranma getting smacked around-- I enjoy the fact that it doesn't actually hurt him. Not really. He's perfectly fine soon after, whether it be in the next frame or the next chapter. Furthermore, it's an exageration--and OTT is what makes a comedy a comedy.

That said, I think Ranma allows himself to be hurt for a different reason, related to reflexes and spiritual awareness. There is a difference between an opponent who is seriously fighting him, and one who is 'punishing' him for some reason. Ranma's danger sense doesn't seem to apply to things like rogue baseballs or otherwise non-attacks that might hurt him.

I would say the exact opposite. The reason why he doesn't dodge or sense the superfluous attacks is because they don't actually hurt him. Why waste energy avoiding something if it doesn't really affect you?

This could be constrewed as a subconcious empathic ability, which could also help explain his learning rate for martial arts techniques, if he actually telepathically absorbs some of the technique's execution from an opponent using it against him.

Empathic ability and telepathic ability are two completely different skills. An empath is limited exclusively to being able to sense or experience the emotions of others. So I fail to see what that has to do with learning techniques. And I think we've been shown pretty conclusively that Ranma is ANYTHING but an empath, because then he would be more aware of how what he says or does makes people angry. I think his ability to learn knew skills quickly can be explained quite simply: He's talented and observant when it comes to Martial Arts.

An empathic ability indicates Ranma can feel the pain of others, this makes him more sympathetic to their plights, because he too knows what it's like to suffer.

It doesn't indicate that Ranma can feel the pain of others, it means that Ranma can feel the pain of others. Which he doesn't, unless he's one hell of a masochist.

Ranma is also, in my opinion, good at heart, and puts others above himself, not just because of his upbringing or his empathic ability, or even his sense of self worth or honor, but because Ranma has an inherent understanding of a sort of basic morality, possibly due to being a victim so often, or perhaps for other reasons. If someone see's an attack against him as justified, because of his empathic ability, part of him sees it from their own point of view, and thus, he allows himself to be punished out of guilt, since he doesn't have the logical skills, thanks to his poor upbringing, to fully realize it's not his fault.

I don't know if we're talking about the same Ranma here. This is the same guy who dressed up as Ryoga's fiance, blantantly exploiting the boy's need for any kind of affection, just because he was jealous that Ryoga and Akane went out on a date. That's not to say that he's all bad, mind you-- I think that deep down he's a good guy. But he ain't no saint. Quite often it really IS his fault. I also don't think that you're giving him enough credit in the logic department. He's been shown to be quite perceptive when the situation calls for it. No Sherlock Holmes, to be sure, but not inept either. He gets justifiably angry when he feels he's been 'punished' unfairly hence the customary line: 'Hey! What'd you do that for?!'

Ranma repeatedly shows that he'll work hard to help those in need with no expected reward

He also often does things purely because of the rewards. Like, for instance, when he's trying to get a cure for his curse. If he is such an altruistic young man, why doesn't he give over the dragon whisker to those poor, bald men who came all the way to Japan to look for it?

he doesn't want to hurt others, even when they hurt him, he'll take punishment to make others feel better. He seems to inherently understand the lesson learned by Peter Parker from the death of Ben Parker, that with great power, comes great responsibility.

Tell me...does the name 'Kuno' mean anything to you? Taking punishment from Kuno would certainly make Kuno feel better. But Ranma doesn't, because even though Kuno is weaker than him, Kuno still actually HURTS Ranma when he manages to land a blow. Ranma also takes much delight in defeating Kuno in a way that is as humiliating as possible (While commenting on Akane's panties while he's at it). Sometimes he'll knock the guy around for no reason other than that he's being annoying. So I don't think he minds hurting 'others'. I DO think he minds hurting certain individuals, though.

Ranma is one of the few in the Ranma1/2 series who rarely abuses his martial arts skills, he's not a bully, he protects the weak and innocent, he asks questions first, and fights later, and is quick to forgive.

I'll grant that Ranma almost never goes out looking for fights, but he certainly likes to flaunt his superiority over others. He can get downright petty, sometimes. The Super Soba arc comes to mind, where he took express delight in creaming Akane in arm wrestling. Repeatedly. You're right in that he's quick to forgive, though.

Even Kasumi and Dr. Tofu are portrayed as slightly evil compared to Ranma, Kasumi is known to do petty things with her chores as revenge when people upset her, tends to be superficial and overly traditional, and seemed to derive pleasure from causing Ranma suffering by piling cats on Ranma when his phobia was discovered. Dr. Tofu often injuries patients and destroys property in Kasumi's presence, and despite being mentally unstable in this way, seems to not be doing anything to correct his behavior, despite his moral responsilibities as a doctor (he shows additional lack of judgement in hiring Genma as a janitor in panda form), he enjoys sneaking up on people and spooking them, and he likes to run away or hide from his problems, like when he has onna-Ranma pretending to be his fiancee for his mother.

I have already shown how manipulative and petty Ranma can be in my other replies. He is definitely worse than both Kasumi and Dr. Tufo when it comes to both atributes. But he's also given a hell of a lot more screen time.

Ranma is just about the only character who really has excuses for almost all of his bad behavior. I can't think of anything off the top of my head that was unjustified or couldn't be explained away by his upbringing or recent circumstances causing lapses of judgement.

Oh, I can think of plenty of times where he did something that was unjustified. I have already cited quite a few. And anyway, using the whole upbringing rationalization is a double-edged sword, because I could then just as easily say that Kuno, or Shampoo, or Genma or ANY of the characters are justified in the way THEY act because of the way they were raised. Which they're not-- Ranma included.

[Nekomata-sensei]

I never said Ranma is perfect, I was mostly generalizing. But I think more what I was trying to get across is that Ranma is amazingly good compared to how he was raised and the circumstances he lives in.
For the Tom and Jerry point, you have to keep in mind what Tom would do if he actually caught Jerry (Likely eat him.) when considering the viciousness of Jerry's tricks. And in most of the cases, Tom seems like he has bad owners, which makes it a good thing if he gets kicked out (because then perhaps he could be found by nicer owners).
Otherwise, I bow to your superior memory and deductive reasoning and argumentive skills.

[Amarielah]

I never said Ranma is perfect, I was mostly generalizing. But I think more what I was trying to get across is that Ranma is amazingly good compared to how he was raised and the circumstances he lives in.

I didn't think you did. I do think that you see Ranma in a far more positive light than I do, though. And I think that that is where we fundamentally disagree with one another--I think that Ranma turned out okay, all facts considered, but hardly 'amazingly good' (even compared to how he was raised). I personally think that Ryoga turned out better in light of the hardships in his life--but that really is just personal opinion coming into it.

For the Tom and Jerry point, you have to keep in mind what Tom would do if he actually caught Jerry (Likely eat him.) when considering the viciousness of Jerry's tricks. And in most of the cases, Tom seems like he has bad owners, which makes it a good thing if he gets kicked out (because then perhaps he could be found by nicer owners).

And likewise, Jerry could just leave and go to a house without a cat. He's obviously clever enough to find one. But if he did there would be no 'Tom and Jerry', there would only be 'Tom and Empty Hole in the Wall'.

Otherwise, I bow to your superior memory and deductive reasoning and argumentive skills.

I try.

[Nekomata-sensei]

I think that Ranma turned out okay, all facts considered, but hardly 'amazingly good' (even compared to how he was raised). I personally think that Ryoga turned out better in light of the hardships in his life--but that really is just personal opinion coming into it.

I'll believe that personal opinion unfounded unless you back it up with a lot of evidence. I can't even think of an incidence where Ryoga didn't do something I'd consider unforgivable in one of his appearances. If he just accepted the reality of his lack of direction sense and didn't try to pin blame for things on others, he could lead a far happier life than Ranma, especially if he tried more to socialize with those he meets during his journeys, lonliness isn't an excuse since he runs into people all the time, and if he wasn't so selfish he might realize that he can help his own state by meeting people and helping others.

[Alathon]

So how come there are no endless debates over familial abuse about the Three Stooges? They were much worse, and it was live action!
Of course it's because it's a comedy.

Probably because most of the people on this board have never watched much Three Stooges. Also, because (from what little I've seen), they all ripped on each other though not always equally, whereas the vast majority of what's perceived as abuse in Ranma 1/2 is one way, especially in the case of Akane. Who is particularly distasteful because the entire Tendo household treats as normal her treating him like shit.

[Pale Wolf]

Not just normal - they treat it as correct. Ace said it best, I think. What's so annoying about her as a character isn't precisely her behaviour, but that she is framed as a sympathetic character without ever actually acting as one.
Fact is, the abuse Ranma tosses out is generally petty (and somewhat pitiful) attempts at revenge.

[Metroidvania]

Not just normal - they treat it as correct. Ace said it best, I think. What's so annoying about her as a character isn't precisely her behaviour, but that she is framed as a sympathetic character without ever actually acting as one.
Fact is, the abuse Ranma tosses out is generally petty (and somewhat pitiful) attempts at revenge.

She does have a _few_ (read: one or two) points of being actually sympathetic...
And yes, when Ranma tries to get back at anyone, it either: A, doesn't work well, if at all.... (See the Jusenkyo Soap with Ryoga for one slightly misconstrued example.)
Or B: gets blown out of proportion by everyone else either furthering the plan or totally ruining it....

[Zwzn]

So how come there are no endless debates over familial abuse about the Three Stooges? They were much worse, and it was live action!
Of course it's because it's a comedy.

Ranma1/2 seems more like Dagon Ball/Z/Gt to me then the Three Stooges when it comes to slap stick. In Dragon Ball the characters like Goku are actually being shot by Bulma. It is just that they are so insanely tuff.

[antimatterenergy]

Amerielah - few things I'd like to address Ranma didn't give the dragon whisker to the old men for a simple reason, Ranma still needed it to prevent his hair from growing uncontrollably and going bald. Ranma often does things without expecting a reward. When he expects a reward it is only becuase he was told about the reward before hand.
Ranma does not flaunt his superiority over others generally. Most of the time he acts fairly meek or down plays his skills such as when he first came to the Tendo's (when asked if he does Kempo said a little). The reason that Ranma did it during the super soba arc is simply becuase Akane was flaunting her strength over Ranma repeatedly and he did it as revenge. Also even though he flaunted his strength he did not do it anywhere near the degree that Akane did (she pushed him through the floor when arm wrestling and made many comments about how she is now stronger).
Even though I believe Ranma to be the most manipulative person in the manga (does it or tries to far more than anyone else. Not saying he's the best at it.) he usually has a reason to. (Even dressing as Ryoga's fiancee and playing with Ryoga's emotions can easily be justified. Here is a few ways, Ryoga's the guy that his fiancee is cheating on him with(going on a date with someone else can be considered cheating), sleeps in his fiancee's bed (as P-chan) ,and has publicly stated that he's going to kill Ranma. Ranma's playing with Ryoga's emotions when compared to that is really not such a big thing.)
My opinion on slapstick is that it's what I like least about the manga.

[Amarielah]

Amerielah - few things I'd like to address Ranma didn't give the dragon whisker to the old men for a simple reason, Ranma still needed it to prevent his hair from growing uncontrollably and going bald. Ranma often does things without expecting a reward. When he expects a reward it is only becuase he was told about the reward before hand.

And I don't see anything wrong with his decision. I was merely pointing out that Ranma is not a martyr by any stretch of the imagination (unless the situation is very, very dire).

Ranma does not flaunt his superiority over others generally. Most of the time he acts fairly meek or down plays his skills such as when he first came to the Tendo's (when asked if he does Kempo said a little). The reason that Ranma did it during the super soba arc is simply becuase Akane was flaunting her strength over Ranma repeatedly and he did it as revenge. Also even though he flaunted his strength he did not do it anywhere near the degree that Akane did (she pushed him through the floor when arm wrestling and made many comments about how she is now stronger).

I'm not talking about Akane, I'm talking about Ranma. The fact that Akane did it first (worse or no) does not justify that HE did it too. Both were in the wrong.

Even though I believe Ranma to be the most manipulative person in the manga (does it or tries to far more than anyone else. Not saying he's the best at it.) he usually has a reason to. (Even dressing as Ryoga's fiancee and playing with Ryoga's emotions can easily be justified. Here is a few ways, Ryoga's the guy that his fiancee is cheating on him with(going on a date with someone else can be considered cheating), sleeps in his fiancee's bed (as P-chan) ,and has publicly stated that he's going to kill Ranma. Ranma's playing with Ryoga's emotions when compared to that is really not such a big thing.)

So then, by your very definition, Akane has a right to do what she does when RANMA goes on a date with somebody else (which he does quite frequently)? Once again, the fact that Ryouga committed an 'injustice' first does not justify the fact that Ranma commits an 'injustice' in retaliation (and in this case it's even debatable if Ranma is doing it with any retaliation in mind). This time, Ranma was in the wrong.

My opinion on slapstick is that it's what I like least about the manga.

But the fact remains that Ranma utilizes slapstick humor as its primary comedic tool. You don't have to like it, but its very much there, and when analyzing anything in the manga you have to bare that in mind. Takahashi's women, almost as a rule, like to slap around men, and the degree that they do is directly linked to the genre of the manga. I assure you, that if Inuyasha were more of a comedy, then Miroku would be sailing to Okinawa every time that Sango hit him with that boomerang of hers.