Here's a thought for a Naruto fic...

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Postby Nekomata-sensei » Wed Jul 12, 2006 4:14 pm

GenocideHeart wrote:The problem with Sakura's skill level is:
She knew an antidote to an INCREDIBLY RARE, NON-LEAF IN ORIGIN poison like Sasori's.

This is not the way to look at it. For one, she didn't _know_ an antidote to it, she _created_ one, by pulling a sample of the poison out of Kankuro's bloodstream, analyzing it with specialized equipment, and formulating a compound that broke it down into a harmless protine.
While the process there is advanced, it wouldn't matter how rare the poison was, or if it came from Leaf or not, Sakura wasn't taught to create anti-venoms to common leaf poisons, she was taught how poisons affect the body, and how to formulate anti-venoms with a sample of an unknown poison.
Sakura was taught how to do this, but not just anybody can learn something like that. Sakura could because she's obviously a genius along the same lines, or perhaps better than Shikamaru. You should note that during the 2nd test of the chuunin exam Sakura was the only one who could answer everything without cheating. Just because she's shallow doesn't mean she's stupid.
As for Sakura being a genjutsu type rather than a ninjutsu type, you're looking at this from the wrong approach. Genjutsu suits Sakura because it requires fine tuned chakra control, very little chakra, and lots of inteligence and imagination. Medical Ninjutsu is very similar in that it requires below average chakra, extreme levels of chakra control, lots of intelignece, and a lot of specialized study. She isn't considered a ninjutsu type because she dosn't have the chakra reserves for most general offensive ninjutsu.
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Postby DCG » Wed Jul 12, 2006 4:58 pm

"She isn't considered a ninjutsu type because she dosn't have the chakra reserves for most general offensive ninjutsu."
And thats becaus no one has trained her at all.
Kakshi only taught em how to climb trees, and spent about 10min doing it.
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Postby Mitchell » Wed Jul 12, 2006 6:57 pm

Actually I think Shikimaru is more intelligent than Sakura. Skikimaru is just lazier and could not be bothered doing the work.
I forget where But I think either during Sakura's or Shikimaru's match in the prelimeries it is mentioned that Shikimaru has a higher IQ than Sakura and people are shoked what with how low a score he passsed the accdemy with.
Last edited by Mitchell on Wed Jul 12, 2006 7:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Nekomata-sensei » Wed Jul 12, 2006 7:00 pm

DCG wrote:"She isn't considered a ninjutsu type because she dosn't have the chakra reserves for most general offensive ninjutsu."
And thats becaus no one has trained her at all.
Kakshi only taught em how to climb trees, and spent about 10min doing it.

If you want, you could write a fanfiction where someone takes team 7's training seriously. Perhaps another jounin sensei, such as Gai or Anko, who would be a bit more enthusiastic about training, or perhaps a reason for Kakashi to behave differently. (maybe an alternate universe where he deals with Oibito's death better, he still wants to care for his comrades above all else, but he remains as driven, timely and responsible as he was before... but perhaps gains another quirk instead, such as he really does help little old ladies with their groceries and turn around when black cats cross his path)
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Postby Dragon Man » Wed Jul 12, 2006 11:05 pm

Nekomata-sensei wrote:If you want, you could write a fanfiction where someone takes team 7's training seriously. Perhaps another jounin sensei, such as Gai or Anko, who would be a bit more enthusiastic about training, or perhaps a reason for Kakashi to behave differently. (maybe an alternate universe where he deals with Oibito's death better, he still wants to care for his comrades above all else, but he remains as driven, timely and responsible as he was before... but perhaps gains another quirk instead, such as he really does help little old ladies with their groceries and turn around when black cats cross his path)

I have Yondaime still alive and Naruto's dad, so Kakashi hasn't lost all his precious people and does a much better job. Rin is also around and drags him to the training site on time. Plus, my version of Team 7 has been together since they were kids, allowing them to train and work together early on and they all have some form of family to help them train.
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Postby Shadell » Wed Jul 12, 2006 11:22 pm

Mitchell wrote:Actually I think Shikimaru is more intelligent than Sakura. Skikimaru is just lazier and could not be bothered doing the work.
I forget where But I think either during Sakura's or Shikimaru's match in the prelimeries it is mentioned that Shikimaru has a higher IQ than Sakura and people are shoked what with how low a score he passsed the accdemy with.

It said he had a higher IQ then 200 if I remember correctly. But even that still ignores the point that there are many different types of IQ. Shikamaru is very good at applied problem solving and puzzles. Sakura however is better at the science and math aspects, as well as general knowledge. Of course Shikamaru might be able to come close to Sakura in those areas if they interested him at all.
"She isn't considered a ninjutsu type because she dosn't have the chakra reserves for most general offensive ninjutsu."
And thats becaus no one has trained her at all.
Kakshi only taught em how to climb trees, and spent about 10min doing it.

And Sakura mastered that training almost instantaneously. Meanwhile Naruto and Sasuke both improved GREATLY from that training. After all Sasuke wasn't able to beat one of Zabuza's clones before he started that training.
Also, to argue that Sakura's potential doesn't lie in one area simply because she hasn't been trained in it doesn't really apply here. After all, her chakra is naturally low. Thus she would have to work much harder then Sasuke or Naruto to master Ninjutsu, while Genjutsu would come easily to her. Given that both are very useful, it makes much more sense for Sakura to train in Genjutsu then to learn ninjutsu.
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Postby Mitchell » Thu Jul 13, 2006 12:15 am

And Sakura mastered that training almost instantaneously. Meanwhile Naruto and Sasuke both improved GREATLY from that training. After all Sasuke wasn't able to beat one of Zabuza's clones before he started that training.

The reason she mastered it so easily was because of her miniscule chakra reserves. Yes they did imporve greatly upon finishing the training, however that was basiclly all the training that team 7 did under Kakashi. If Kakashi trained them at least a little bit they would be much better.
We have no idea if Sakura's math and science ability is greater than Shikimaru's, however we do know that she was top of the class in theory work, but at that time Skikimaru slept through class and had only a marginlly greater grade than Naruto.
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Postby Dragon Man » Thu Jul 13, 2006 12:18 am

Mitchell wrote:The reason she mastered it so easily was because of her miniscule chakra reserves. Yes they did imporve greatly upon finishing the training, however that was basiclly all the training that team 7 did under Kakashi. If Kakashi trained them at least a little bit they would be much better.

I agree. But in a flashback it did show him apparently trying to teach Naruto the Chidori or at least humoring him while watching him go through the motions. Plus, he might have trained them in trap building or some other stuff we just don't see, like tracking since they had to chase down Madame Shinji's cat Tora alot.
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Postby DCG » Thu Jul 13, 2006 12:38 am

Dragon Man wrote:[
I agree. But in a flashback it did show him apparently trying to teach Naruto the Chidori or at least humoring him while watching him go through the motions. Plus, he might have trained them in trap building or some other stuff we just don't see, like tracking since they had to chase down Madame Shinji's cat Tora alot.

Odd, i don't remember that flash back? And i find it rather odd considering naruto learned his blue ball of doom real fast.
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Postby Dragon Man » Thu Jul 13, 2006 12:41 am

DCG wrote:Odd, i don't remember that flash back? And i find it rather odd considering naruto learned his blue ball of doom real fast.

It was one Sakura had after Sasuke left Konoha or before Tsunade arrived in the village, I can't remember which....
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Postby Shadell » Thu Jul 13, 2006 12:52 am

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The reason she mastered it so easily was because of her miniscule chakra reserves. Yes they did imporve greatly upon finishing the training, however that was basiclly all the training that team 7 did under Kakashi. If Kakashi trained them at least a little bit they would be much better.
We have no idea if Sakura's math and science ability is greater than Shikimaru's, however we do know that she was top of the class in theory work, but at that time Skikimaru slept through class and had only a marginlly greater grade than Naruto.

Sakura has low chakra, but she also has good control. Making an argument that she was only able to learn that because her control was good, is like saying "Naruto sucks. The only reason he could use Kage Bunshin was because he has a lot of chakra" IE: technically true, but it sounds kind of stupid when you think about it. Also. Sakura was able to do it on her FIRST try. Even if she had say 1/8 of Sasuke's power, the control she showed allowed her to walk up the tree FAR higher then that. Thus it isn't entirely unreasonable to assume that Sakura's chakra is also proportionaly large.
As to the math and science part. At least a few of the questions on the chunin exam involved math. IE: the first one that they read off about the shuriken. You could argue that Shikamaru was just to lazy to do it, but the fact remains that Sakura did accomplish it while Shikamaru did not. Also poisoning, at least the way Sakura did it is very much a science, and I have a good deal of trouble seeing Shikamaru pull off an antidote like that.
Odd, i don't remember that flash back? And i find it rather odd considering naruto learned his blue ball of doom real fast.

Hmm... I don't remember any flashback like that either. But I do think they wanted to imply at least some training before Team 7 went with Tazuna. Also, the teamwork they displayed during the bridge arc was far greater then earlier. So unless Sasuke and Naruto spontaneously developed good non-verbal communication and team work, then Kakashi had to have trained them a good deal as well.
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Postby Mitchell » Thu Jul 13, 2006 1:01 am

I did not say that the only reason she learnd to tree walk was because of her low chakra capacity, but that was a major factor in her great control. She had so little chakra to manipulate compared to Sasuke or Naruto.
Yeah Shikimaru did not just answer the questions, however he is a lazy sob. It would be easier to cheat at the exam than work the problems out.
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Postby DCG » Thu Jul 13, 2006 1:22 am

How i feel about naruto is covered rather well in the first part of this chapter
http://www.fanfiction.net/s/2290899/9/
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Postby Mitchell » Thu Jul 13, 2006 1:32 am

Foxhound = Very cool fic. To bad the author has no intention of finishing it. He has gone on and nearly finished a Naruto/Star wars crack fic where Naruto apprentices under Darth Vader. The author is also working on a fic dealing with one of the coolest Sith lords ever, Revan.
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Postby Adyen » Fri Jul 14, 2006 11:29 am

Mitchell wrote:I did not say that the only reason she learnd to tree walk was because of her low chakra capacity, but that was a major factor in her great control. She had so little chakra to manipulate compared to Sasuke or Naruto.
Yeah Shikimaru did not just answer the questions, however he is a lazy sob. It would be easier to cheat at the exam than work the problems out.

Sakura is a very interesting enigma. You can't say that she's strong (pre-3 years training) nor can you say that she doesn't have potential (as seen post-3 year training), but the biggest focal point is the question: CAN you train yourself to produce more chakra.
Now, we know chakra is created by mixing physical energy and spiritual energy together. So let's look at Sakura when she first joined the team:
Her physicals are low. As in, she's probably one of the weakest one to leave the academy. Looking at canon, she draws with Ino - who is also one of the weakest physically.
She has no bloodline ability (that we know of), no secret family techniques, and no specialized training; coupled with a low chakra reserve and a high intellegence, this places her firmly in the Genjustu type.
Now the question was, "could you train to create more chakra". I personally think "yes, but it is not worth the time invested". Sakura has never demonstrated a high physical ability throughout her entire time in Team 7 - she tires out quicker on less, and Kakashi himself is a ninjutsu-type ninja, thus would focus on that aspect more than anything. (And being the lazy bastard he is, he wouldn't want to take the extra time to train physically because both Naruto and Sasuke are already strong on physical abilities - not to be mixed with taijutsu, of course)
I think the main reason why Sakura grew so much during those 3 years is due to her own determination to become stronger (something that is missing for most of the time when she's in Team 7), as well as the fact that Tsunade is one of the (if not THE) foremost Medic-Nin in the world. She knows exactly how you need to train someone to strengthen their physical abilities, as well as tricks to help with chakra control/distrubution. We also don't know all the things Sakura went through to train, but I wouldn't hesitate to guess it was quite grueling and compairable to Gai's training.
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