The War of Kings [Code Geass and Fate/Stay Night Crossover]

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Re: The War of Kings [Code Geass and Fate/Stay Night Crossover]

Postby OSMQEP » Sun Sep 04, 2011 2:31 pm

copper-based and obviously ferromagnetic

Do you mean 'ferromagnetic' or 'not ferromagnetic'?

Also, will the King of Games be showing up? If the Grail War lasts longer, and things are messed up anyways, I see much more leeway for meddling with the class system for extra summons, or the part that regulates such things simply failing due to abnormal operating conditions.

Also, having looked up Anya on tvtropes, Ouch.
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Re: The War of Kings [Code Geass and Fate/Stay Night Crossover]

Postby Pale Wolf » Sun Sep 04, 2011 2:50 pm

Do you mean 'ferromagnetic' or 'not ferromagnetic'?


I meant ferromagnetic, though on checking my references I seem to have flutzed up a bit. I was remembering railguns as requiring ferromagnetic projectiles, but apparently not. Good to remember.

Also, will the King of Games be showing up?


King of Games? If that's a historical or FSN character, it doesn't come to mind.

If the Grail War lasts longer, and things are messed up anyways, I see much more leeway for meddling with the class system for extra summons, or the part that regulates such things simply failing due to abnormal operating conditions.


Yup, and attempts to summon Servants who're already there will also be messing with loads and loads of things.

Also, having looked up Anya on tvtropes, Ouch.


An appropriate summary for her, yes.
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Re: The War of Kings [Code Geass and Fate/Stay Night Crossover]

Postby OSMQEP » Sun Sep 04, 2011 5:08 pm

I meant ferromagnetic, though on checking my references I seem to have flutzed up a bit. I was remembering railguns as requiring ferromagnetic projectiles, but apparently not. Good to remember.


I wasn't sure what the launching system required, I think I forget to even check if it was a rail gun, or a coil gun. I figured that if the launching system needed it, other types of material can be added to the projectile, making it not obvious unless the projectile had to be a homogeneous slug, which would also limit possible safety mechanisms. So I wondered if it might be a typo, because it seemed to make more sense that way.

The main reason for using Copper that came to mind before was that it was somehow worked better than Iron. I haven't the chemistry in that area to even know how well Copper would replace Iron in that reaction. After I posted I realized that the Copper was mentioned to explain the green glow, instead of to replace the Iron. I'd remembered mention of railguns and coil guns earlier in the text, and had vague memories of having read about at least one of those, which IIRC hadn't required ferromagnetic projectiles.

King of Games?


Old Man gives kid an ancient artifact. Kid spends a lot brainsweat unlocking its secrets, and releases an entity. Entity possesses kid, and kills people left and drives them insane right.

Said entity predates your cleft point, is originally human, is involved in many heroic acts, was in a leadership position, is titled King of Games for an exceptional trait, turns out to be a good guy, and is by some measures the main charector of the first series of Yu-Gi-Oh.

The whole 'world is doomed, got to save it' vibe from Archer, the Servant selection criteria, and the sheer carnage in both Yu-Gi-Oh and your story brought it to mind.
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Re: The War of Kings [Code Geass and Fate/Stay Night Crossover]

Postby Pale Wolf » Sun Sep 04, 2011 6:04 pm

I wasn't sure what the launching system required, I think I forget to even check if it was a rail gun, or a coil gun. I figured that if the launching system needed it, other types of material can be added to the projectile, making it not obvious unless the projectile had to be a homogeneous slug, which would also limit possible safety mechanisms. So I wondered if it might be a typo, because it seemed to make more sense that way.

The main reason for using Copper that came to mind before was that it was somehow worked better than Iron. I haven't the chemistry in that area to even know how well Copper would replace Iron in that reaction. After I posted I realized that the Copper was mentioned to explain the green glow, instead of to replace the Iron. I'd remembered mention of railguns and coil guns earlier in the text, and had vague memories of having read about at least one of those, which IIRC hadn't required ferromagnetic projectiles.


Yeah, I'm nowhere near sufficient mastery of chemistry to work out the actual formula of their thermite equivalent, but the green glow implies copper-based. (Well, actually the green glow implies 'the animators felt like drawing it green', but copper-based was the closest sense I could make there)

But yeah, I messed up a tad on the railgun mechanism and projectile. They do use railguns, though - or at least the EU does, Britannia has much less of them and more coilguns. (Britannia is the most mobile army in the world, but the EU are the gunmasters)

Old Man gives kid an ancient artifact. Kid spends a lot brainsweat unlocking its secrets, and releases an entity. Entity possesses kid, and kills people left and drives them insane right.

Said entity predates your cleft point, is originally human, is involved in many heroic acts, was in a leadership position, is titled King of Games for an exceptional trait, turns out to be a good guy, and is by some measures the main charector of the first series of Yu-Gi-Oh.

The whole 'world is doomed, got to save it' vibe from Archer, the Servant selection criteria, and the sheer carnage in both Yu-Gi-Oh and your story brought it to mind.


Heh. I was sort of suspecting... but yeah, no Yu Gi Oh crossovering. Sorry? ^^;
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Re: The War of Kings [Code Geass and Fate/Stay Night Crossover]

Postby OSMQEP » Mon Sep 05, 2011 4:46 pm

Anyway, now that I've had a chance to dig into my memories, it seems like a coil gun or rail gun would make sense most if it works by electromagnetic induction. In which case, the projectile would mainly need something conductive to carry the eddy currents. I'd think that the metal in the 'thermite' itself would be too fragmented work well, and the thermite would be too prone to cooking off if it was interacting with the EM fields enough to pick up a good turn of speed. I'm not sure how a coil gun or rail gun could add enough rotation to a projectile to provide the usual sort of stability in flight either, so I probably ought to start telling myself because magic on this issue until the next update or I get the time and computer access to do proper C&C.

Fewer crossovers is probably better discipline and more likely to lead to a tighter story.

Ah, true. Though I seem to recall Kiritsugu and Irisviel were doing similarly? (It'd certainly make sense, given the homunculus massive prana reserves...)


Kiri summoned the Servant normally, then stuck the catalyst in Iris, and had her wander around with the Servant pretending to be the Master while he ran around backstabbing people. Saber's battle methods were simply too incompatible with Kiri's for them to work directly together, and Kiri planned around that.

The husband and wife Masters of Lancer had researched a special version of the ritual, unique to them, and figured they had the game in the bag with it. Essentially, the wife anchored the servant, and kept it in existance with her prana, while the husband got the command seals, and could devote his prana to powering abilities, combat, commanding, sensory sharing and other such things.

I've also started wondering about Nunnally. If she is descended from Lancer and Saber (assuming a near canon Saber), or similar bloodlines, I am wondering if there could be enough inhuman in her to be noticeable. I'm also wondering if the prana from Fuyuki will do anything to her from a distance. If Lelouch is significantly motivated by his sister's welfare, what would happen if she were to invert, stand up, open her eyes, and decide that Shishio Makato had the right idea? (Shishio is a RuroKen villain known for trying to take over Japan to implement his strong eat the weak ideal.)

Anyway, I think I'm still hoping for a good ending for all the charectors you've introduced so far. (Except Clovis. I still hope the Lloyd and Cecile aren't dead, but I have little confidence in that.)
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Re: The War of Kings [Code Geass and Fate/Stay Night Crossover]

Postby Pale Wolf » Mon Sep 05, 2011 6:00 pm

Anyway, now that I've had a chance to dig into my memories, it seems like a coil gun or rail gun would make sense most if it works by electromagnetic induction. In which case, the projectile would mainly need something conductive to carry the eddy currents. I'd think that the metal in the 'thermite' itself would be too fragmented work well, and the thermite would be too prone to cooking off if it was interacting with the EM fields enough to pick up a good turn of speed. I'm not sure how a coil gun or rail gun could add enough rotation to a projectile to provide the usual sort of stability in flight either, so I probably ought to start telling myself because magic on this issue until the next update or I get the time and computer access to do proper C&C.


Yeah, there's a certain degree of 'because magic' that's basically unavoidable. They manage to avoid the cooking off problem by only having the elements of thermite combine at the very last stage before leaving the barrel. The railgun can provide the usual rotation by having the rails twist, but I'm not actually sure how a coilgun does it.

Fewer crossovers is probably better discipline and more likely to lead to a tighter story.


*Whistles innocently, looking at a few other works*

Kiri summoned the Servant normally, then stuck the catalyst in Iris, and had her wander around with the Servant pretending to be the Master while he ran around backstabbing people.

The husband and wife Masters of Lancer had researched a special version of the ritual, unique to them, and figured they had the game in the bag with it. Essentially, the wife anchored the servant, and kept it in existance with her prana, while the husband got the command seals, and could devote his prana to powering abilities, combat, commanding, sensory sharing and other such things.


Ahhh, my error. Well, for this, the Einzberns pushed their cheating ways a little farther than in canon :P

I've also started wondering about Nunnally. If she is descended from Lancer and Saber (assuming a near canon Saber), or similar bloodlines, I am wondering if there could be enough inhuman in her to be noticeable.


Possibly, though I will note that the early Britannian throne didn't pass down through bloodlines - the King essentially picked out prospective candidates, watched how they developed, then tossed it off to whichever one looked best. Arturia and Eowyn aren't related at all, though it is possible that one or both bloodlines made it back to the throne of Britannia before it started getting passed down through heredity.

The closest model here is Gaelic tanistry, which I suppose might not be that much of a surprise for a Celtic culture like Britannia started as.

I'm also wondering if the prana from Fuyuki will do anything to her from a distance. If Lelouch is significantly motivated by his sister's welfare, what would happen if she were to invert, stand up, open her eyes, and decide that Shishio Makato had the right idea? (Shishio is a RuroKen villain known for trying to take over Japan to implement his strong eat the weak ideal.)


Well, that would definitely be something that would... motivate... Lelouch. Though if the Fuyuki prana were gonna do anything to her, it'd probably do it to Lelouch first, considering he was actually there and for a fair bit longer.
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Re: The War of Kings [Code Geass and Fate/Stay Night Crossover]

Postby OSMQEP » Mon Sep 05, 2011 6:26 pm

They manage to avoid the cooking off problem by only having the elements of thermite combine at the very last stage before leaving the barrel.


I only got a C in physical chemistry, but this still bugs me. (Surface area, mixing rate... All the things that make binary chemical weapons a pain in an incendiary, and you'd almost certainly would need a casing anyway.) The point I was going for with the cooking off issue is that it would seem to make sense to wrap the thing in a conductive casing, rather than rely on the properties of the material itself to get it up to speed.

A really conductive layer for speed with minimal heat generation, an insulating layer to control heat transfer, and then the filler, would seem both simple and safe enough that the heat transfer would not autoignite the projectile under normal operating conditions until it left the barrel. For added safety and bells and whistles factor, have a laser ignite the thing via a sensitive patch at the back once it leaves the barrel.

Anyway, because magic.
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Re: The War of Kings [Code Geass and Fate/Stay Night Crossover]

Postby Pale Wolf » Tue Apr 24, 2012 1:12 am

Hm? Normally I link up a table of contents at the start of the first post, links straight to each chapter. Is it not working? It seems to for me...

(On FFNet, I really should at some point, I suppose. My FFNet account's like ten chapters behind.)
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Re: The War of Kings [Code Geass and Fate/Stay Night Crossover]

Postby OSMQEP » Tue Nov 06, 2012 3:21 pm

Pale Wolf wrote:Wow, I actually caught this response less than a week late. Score!


Well, I'm projecting election stuff on my end through tomorrow. Probably the earliest I'll have sense to get back to work on my various sets of notes for chapter five will be some time later.

Pale Wolf wrote:Well, I will say this. Canada's Anglophone settlers were, primarily, the United Empire Loyalists. The term you may be more familiar with in the US is 'Tories'. But in Code Geass? The Washington Revolt failed. The loyalists won.

Britannia is Canada. (Seriously, I dare you to look at the imperial throne room - maple leaves everywhere behind that throne)


I am aware of or figured most of this. (I've never seen images of the Britannian throne room.) My thought was more along the lines of 'Suppose that both Paine and the ancestral Cullen are in the Colonies, under Crown rule. If Paine could hypothetically end up in Australia, why not Cullen?' I kind of miss Canada's old flag, I think it is neater.

Pale Wolf wrote:As for shock infantry, they're most definitely still in use.


Yay. Memo to self: Figure out some words to fit 'I Loves the Infantries, all of the Infantries, be they shock, mech or light' to the song 'Napalm sticks to kids'.


Pale Wolf wrote:Aonach


By Olympic cognate I was referring to the code name for some of the planned invasions of Japan that the US never carried out. (IIRC, Downfall and Coronet were also used.) (I think they were, given how well the Japanese prepared, a bit bloody to use. Without the bomb, I figure the Japanese would have been starved out, or to death. (IIRC, some months after the surrender, with American supplied food aid, in some cities people were getting something like 1,000 calories per day.))


Pale Wolf wrote:(And it occurs to me that there aren't actually any 'younger cast' of Code Geass that are Japanese other than Suzaku and Kaguya... I doubled the number just with Kokoro and Takara...)


I'd suggest, partly in jest, that maybe what happened in canon was a combination of 'guided anti tank mine' and 'Grave of the Fireflies'. Seriously, the Elevens probably are not mistreated badly enough for the occupation force to have experienced killing that many youngsters in the invasion.

Pale Wolf wrote:Japan managed to retain some child training stuff under 'cultural interests' and 'our samurai heritage', but the products of that are really rare - like, Toudou and his boys, and Suzaku (though he was more benefiting from demon hunter training than military training).


I figure that if First Pacific saw the degree of fanatic militarism Imperial Japan had, there would still be a fairly good cadre floating around the population in time for Second Pacific, even if they are keeping their heads down due to orders. Anyway, yeah, isolated full training for pockets on the one hand. On the other, hand, maybe there was time, funds, and from the earlier program, cadre for a broader program in between Britannia declaring war, and them finishing. On the gripping hand, it is quite possible that this has already been covered, and I am just wandering around, in need of sleep.
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Re: The War of Kings [Code Geass and Fate/Stay Night Crossov

Postby OSMQEP » Wed Nov 14, 2012 7:05 pm

I have some notes, so I will continue working off them and off the spacebattles thread.

I didn't keep full records of everything I've posted.

I also didn't keep records of the clues that I had gathered to deduce certain things, and I suspect some of them lost with certain posts this thread. (I thought I had a real cute idea for wrapping the reveal inside a Yotsuba/Detective Conan fic. I hadn't collected the bits partly because I was still working on the wrapper. I also had a whole host of possible identities to suggest for Caster. Lelouch, for one.)

Anyway, Lancer is most likely Merlin's bastard child. As I recall, beyond the text, there was something you mentioned in the spacebattles thread, and something you mentioned here.
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Re: The War of Kings [Code Geass and Fate/Stay Night Crossov

Postby Pale Wolf » Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:25 pm

... Ew. I need to take better notes, because I was keeping some of them on the thread to begin with...

Go ahead with what you've got. Even if you asked it before, it's good to have it written out somewhere.

I also had a whole host of possible identities to suggest for Caster. Lelouch, for one.)


Heh. Nah, Lelouch is more inclined to Rider or Assassin (though he can be stretched to Archer). (He can also manage all the non-standard classes - Ruler, Saviour, Avenger)

But as I noted in the SB thread, Caster is someone that Lancer will recognize.

Anyway, Lancer is most likely Merlin's bastard child. As I recall, beyond the text, there was something you mentioned in the spacebattles thread, and something you mentioned here.


Well, I won't confirm or deny, obviously. But I can see how one gets to that theory. ;)
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